“I don’t want to disappoint anyone and I don’t want to be a coward or anything like that…okay, but you know what. Okay, no. fluidity is a very important thing to acknowledge.When we made [Mulan], fluidity was not a word. We didn’t talk about fluidity. Now we have fluidity. Now we watch Shang and his choices and his actions and see it through fluidity. This whole idea that there’s a needle and it goes from zero to 100 and it doesn’t have to be one place or another. It can move. You can change your pronouns and then change them the next day if you want and that’s good and should be the way it is. So in that case, I’m recalibrating my answer. Of course, he was. Of course, he was! What other reason would there be?”— Actor BD Wong, discussing the sexuality of his character Li Shang in the Disney animated film Mulan with comedian Bowen Yang. Over the years, Li Shang has become something of a bisexual icon for his attraction to Mulan both as feminine-presenting, and in male drag. Disney also may have noticed, as the recent live-action version of Mulan eliminated the character of Li Shang.
Donston
Yes, a lot of people experience degrees of sexual/gender fluidity or contradictions. Sexuality and gender expressions encompass a lot elements and are very individual. And the gender, romantic, sexual, affection, emotional investment, relationship contentment spectrum is wide and varied. On the other hand, I’m a little bothered by this patterned of retroactively adding “hidden” meaning to kids’ stories or retroactively re-writing character dynamics. It’s a bit pandering. While it’s still often filtered through hetero normalcy and hetero-relationship expectations. And it’s one of those things that allows Hollywood to keep getting away with not showing unabashed “queerness”.
BaltoSteve
I wouldn’t say it is so much retroactively adding “hidden” meaning to the character. It’s examining the character with what we now know and realizing what may have been what the creators were attempting to personify in the cartoon character. It’s like looking back on Hanna Barbara cartoons and KNOWING that Snagglepuss was a flaming friend of Dorothy. They couldn’t call him gay at the time, but they could incorporate mannerisms and dialog that now as an adult you know exactly who he was.
Donston
The difference is that with your example there was intention and subtext. That really wasn’t there in Mulan. Nor does it actually fit into what most people view as “fluidity”. It just seems like fluid/fluidity has become another catch-all term that means whatever the individual wants it to. It’s already been rendered almost useless.
I’m tired of the constant searching for “queer” undertones and subtext and the queer-fetishizing of “straight presenting” characters, instead of actually pushing for more entertainment to be unabashedly “queer”. I’m also tired of the identity peddling. Will we ever learn to express ourselves and dimensions and struggles honestly without trying to find some summation word? And once again, what he explained is not what most people view as “fluidity”.
Cam
I agree, like when JK Rowling claimed Dumbledore was gay after the books and movies were done, then of course the later movies came out and they erased it again.
But, I also do like the idea that a character may have been LGBTQ, and the author wrote about some of the behavior and maybe at the time didn’t even realize what it signified.
An example could be, for anyone who has read Pride and Prejudice, the character of Charlotte Lucas. She is older for the time, 28, has no interest in love, tells her best friend that she isn’t romantic romantic like other women, and then sets her sights on and marries the repellent Mr. Collins, after which she laughs with Lizzy later about how she’s arranged it so she and Mr. Collins, her husband sometimes go entire days without seeing each other.
I think Austen may have been describing someone who was a lesbian, asexual, etc. but didn’t realize that could be what that behavior may have indicated. Or maybe Austen was way more hip and subversive than I give her credit for.
BaltoSteve
@Donston, from what I remember, yeah his behaviour could Now be called fluid. Unfortunately neither of us actually KNOW what the intention was behind giving him those traits and aspects. All we do know is that he had behviour quirks that can be view be different people in different ways. Which seems to be the case here.
barryaksarben
SO much of old movies can now be viewed differently as so much was hidden back then. Ma y filmmakers from the golden age wrote in their bios about the true meaning in famous movies and scenes. Rock Hudson comes to mind and Red River where Monty Cliff and John Ireland laughed about how their gun fight was men comparing penis. And BEN HUR where Stephen BOYD was told to play his character as gay for Ben Hur
Manrico Jimenez
I can’t wait to see him in jurassic world dominion!
humble charlie
People want what they want. Sometimes you want a guy, sometimes a girl depending on what they look like and what you feel like. I guess that applies to cartoons also.
MacAdvisor
As the ol’ Almond Joy/Mounds commercial put it, “Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don’t.”
Openminded
I’ve watched Mulan more times than I can count and I can’t make anything Shang did seem anything but straight. Will someone please point out what he did that was fluid? Yeah, Mulan was male presenting at first only out of necessity not sexual leanings, but it wasn’t until Mulan was revealed as female AND helped save the Emperor that Shang displayed any affection for her. I believe this is yet another case of wanting to jump on the bandwagon AFTER you discover it’s a pretty important wagon.