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If a Real Housewife doesn’t have gays podcast talking about them on a podcast, do they even exist?

But we’re not just talking about any gay, or any podcast—we’re talking about Ben Mandelker, whose Watch What Crappens—the talk show dedicated to all things Bravo (and beyond!)—permanently sits atop the Apple Podcasts charts. This is gay podcasting royalty right here!

For over 12 years, Mandelker and co-host Ronnie Karam have produced the wildly popular pod, which dives deep into the wide world of television, from Below Deck to House Of The Dragon. Of course, their main focus always has and always will be the ever-evolving Real Housewives franchise—and lord knows those dramatic ladies always leave them with plenty to discuss.

Watch What Happens has been hailed as a must-listen for reality TV fans (they won Best Pop Culture Podcast earlier this year at the iHeart awards), and is often pointed to as one of the first podcasts to successfully turn their operation into a “touring machine,” frequently getting face-time with fans as they put on riotous live shows all over the country and across the globe, too!

However, Mandelker doesn’t spend every waking minute of his life talking about Housewives, so when he’s not recording, he keeps busy with writing, quoting classic movie sand TV shows, obsessing over Ina Garten, sewing his own clothes, and playing nearly every board game imaginable—he’s got a podcast about that, too, by the way, and it’s called Game Brain.

Ahead of a very busy fall that will see the returns of The Real Housewives Of New York and Salt Lake City, as well as another tour for Watch What Happens, Queerty snagged some time with Mandelker, making him the latest guest of our rapid-fire Q&A series, Dishin’ It. In our conversation, the podcaster opens up about pop culture as a gateway to finding shared community, board games for queers, and which Housewives cast he thinks he’d vibe best with.

Is there a piece of media—whether a movie, TV series, book, album, theater, video game, etc…—that has played an important role in your understanding of queerness and the queer community? Why does it stand out to you?

I immediately think of three of my favorite comedies of all time: Soapdish, Big Business, and Bullets Over Broadway. I’ve seen all three so many times that I can’t keep track anymore. When I was younger I would replay them endlessly. I would even record scenes from Big Business on my tape recorder and then just *listen* back to them—sometimes in the car stereo player (my poor parents).

Later on, when I came out of the closet, I quickly discovered that many fellow gays also idolized these movies.  I can say certain quotes—”You look like a blood clot,” “On the machine, Rose, on the machine!,” “Don’t speak. DO NOT SPEAK!”—and if I’m amongst gays, most of them will know what and who I’m referencing. It’s like the most fabulous, camp dog whistle ever.

It’s great knowing there are others out there who bow down to Diane Wiest and Lily Tomlin and Cathy Moriarity, but on a more significant level, it speaks to the queer community and the shorthand we have with each other, usually in the form of pop culture references. When you spend so much of your life feeling like an outsider, wondering if you fit in, small moments like quoting these sorts of movies remind me that there’s a large queer community that accepts me and understands me.

Thanks to your hit podcast Watch What Crappens, you’re deep into the world of the Real Housewives. It hasn’t always been a franchise with the best queer representation, and in fact has even featured some housewives who actively act (and vote) against our better interests, so in your opinion—and here’s the big question—what is it that makes Real Housewives appealing to so many gays?

Considering that modern Bravo was built on the backs of Queer Eye For The Straight Guy, it’s always so surprising to see how few queer people are centered on their shows. We are starting to see some queer women in the ranks—Jenna Lyons on RHONY, Julia Lemigova on RHOM—but usually queerness is only expressed as a clickbait storyline (let us never forget Kim Zolciak’s romance with DJ Tracy Young).  Gay men flitter in and out, usually in sidekick form, ready to breathlessly defend whichever Housewife they’re attached to, but that’s about it.

Still, we tune in because honestly, our love of camp is hard to resist. Yes, there are some truly hateful ladies on these shows, and several have deeply problematic attitudes toward our community, but there’s almost an element that if we all come together and mock them relentlessly, we’re taking back our power. Also, let’s not forget how much we love a strident, outspoken woman. We revere these women because they express their femininity in such a brash way while many of us had to repress similar instincts at some point in our lives. 

A bawdy, ridiculous, and sexual Real Housewife is ultimately speaking her truth, no matter how problematic, and I think that distinctly appeals to gay men—not the problematic part, but the unabashedly themselves part.  This is why we love our monsters. Joan Crawford anyone? Also, these ladies are viciously hilarious, and sometimes that’s all we need.

Which current Housewives cast do you think you’d mesh best with if you were to join the series and why?

I like to think I’d mesh best with the ladies of RHONY and RHOBH, but honestly, I don’t know fashion very well, and you need to be a fashion gay to hang with them. That being said, I have a strange feeling that I could watch episodes of Barefoot Contessa with Sutton Stracke, and that’s not nothing! But ultimately, RHOSLC might be my lane. I feel like I could drink martinis with Meredith Marks and then watch reality TV with Angie K on the same night.

You’re getting ready to tour the US again this fall with the pod—what’s your favorite and least favorite thing about being on tour? 

I love going to these cities and meeting new people and seeing returning listeners.  We’ve been touring since 2017, and over the years, we’ve gotten to know people in all these regions, and it’s amazing to see the Crappens communities that have popped up across the country. Plus, not going to lie, the rush of being on stage and landing a good joke is pretty amazing. When I was a kid I always wanted to be the star of the school musical, but I was always cast as a tree or some chimney sweep.  Being on stage really helps live out those kids’ dreams. 

The worst part, however, is that traveling can be a bear. It’s fun at first, but by the end of the tour, it can really wear you down. My eating schedule gets all messed up, my workout routine gets upended, and I miss a lot of social engagements back home in LA.  Plus, I really do wind up missing my boyfriend a lot, which is so cheesy but a reality.

Where’s one of the first spaces you can remember that made you feel a part of a queer community?

A few months after I first came out of the closet, my friend Kyle Buchanan invited me to gay poker on Mondays. I didn’t really enjoy poker, but I showed up anyway. It was weird at first—so many gay men (and also so much poker)—but once I let down my guard, I felt extremely welcomed. Despite never really connecting with the game itself, I went to Kyle’s poker night every Monday for several years. Eventually, as Crappens grew, Mondays became a tougher night for me to play poker, but I still maintain friendships with many of those guys to this day.  One of them literally just waved at me from their car as I was crossing a street in Los Feliz the other night!

Who’s a fictional character you had a crush on at a younger age (or maybe still do!)? What do you remember loving about them?

Who didn’t I have a crush on at a younger age?? I’m pretty sure I had a thing for He-Man. Great body, and superpowers—he was the total package (except maybe the haircut). There was also a run of ‘80s sitcom characters: Alex P. Keaton, Theo Huxtable, Mike Seaver, and Kevin from Mr. Belvedere. They were all cute and popular. Especially Alex P. Keaton. Children of the ‘80s know.

And we have two give your other pod, Game Brain, a shout out, too! Since you’re a board game expert, what’s a game you’d like to recommend you think the gays would love?

Yes! Game Brain is a show I joined a few years ago, and amusingly, it’s mostly middle-aged straight men! I’m obsessed with board games, but I have to say: not a lot of gay representation in the hobby. 

That being said, there’s a new game coming out called Molly House that takes place in the molly houses of 19th century London—a space for the queer community at the time.  Oh, and game designer Amabel Holland of Hollandspiele Games is a member of the trans community and often imbues her works with queer subtext. There’s an excellent profile about her in a recent issue of the New Yorker. 

As far as game recs, I think everyone should own a copy of a game called Concordia. It’s just amazing and pretty easy to learn. Plus, the lady on the cover looks like Teresa Giudice, which may be appealing to some gays.

Who is a queer or trans artist/performer/creator that you think is doing really cool work right now? Why are they someone we should all be paying attention to?

I’m cheating and giving two: Bowen Yang and Matt Rogers.  My co-host Ronnie and I performed at Just For Laughs in Vancouver years ago, and the night before we decided to check out Las Culturistas’ “I Don’t Think So Honey!” on a whim. Forever glad we did. I was so impressed with a) how funny they were, b) how smart they were, and c) how generous they were to their guests. They let other people be funny and didn’t chew up the scenery, which is real BDE when it comes to comedy. 

I’ve loved watching their stars rise (I’m acting like some parasocial auntie), and I think it’s great that they each do their own projects but come together to make this amazing comic magic with their podcast. Also, so impressed with their Culture Awards. I can’t wait to see where they take their podcast down the line.

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